London

by Ron Gilbert
Feb 12, 2017

Finally back in the States, head to the grindstone, franticly working on Thimbleweed Park. Many thanks to the other team members who picked up the slack.

We had a great time talking to fans and the press, trying to spread the word about this amazing point and click adventure game we're working on. Maybe you've heard of it. It's called Thimbleweed Park. Please buy 10 copies.

Here are some pictures of the London event, curtesy of @FinlayCostello. We had a great time showing everyone the game, signing boxes, taking selfies and 80's Polaroid's.

David, Gary and I will be recording a podcast on Monday. We've been busy working on this amazing point and click adventure game. Maybe you've heard of it. It's called Thimbleweed Park. Please buy 10 copies.



EdoBvd - Feb 12, 2017 at 12:17
Can't wait.
Wish I could have join the London event...
For TP2 maybe :-)

Patrik Spacek - Feb 12, 2017 at 12:18
So many hours in the airplane is killing...but at least you had fun in tue Europe. I will buy a copy.

Vincent - Feb 12, 2017 at 12:26
Yep ! it is sound a great time to you talking to fans of the word about this amazing point and click adventure game you are working on.
When can we buy one copy of this franticly point and click adventure game is Thimbleweed Park ? FYI, I am open to test it now :)
Are the French sound track finish for French market ?
I am dreaming all days to play to this new amazing P'ndC...
Bye
Vincent-

Ron Gilbert - Feb 12, 2017 at 12:29
The french translation is done, but the full voice is only in English.

Tony - Feb 12, 2017 at 12:41
Why no post about the Berlin event? Was it crappy?

Simon Simon - Feb 12, 2017 at 13:38
I loved the Berlin event, it was fantastic. However I was a little bit too shy to talk Jenn or Ron, besides asking for an autograph.
Trading the trading cards with other fans was fun (see Jenn's photo on twitter)!

The game looks stunning- although I tried to avoid spoilers so I did not play much of it and I looked away when certain areas were displayed on the large screen. It turms out to be more and more difficult to avoid spoilers, also some review articles that have been released in the last couple of days give away quite some puzzle related information so I tend to only scan through them.
I was most excited about the shaders: Ransome opens a door, and a beam of light illuminates his face - so amazing to see!

entropy - Feb 12, 2017 at 13:47
Oh yeah, the problem with spoilers gets more and more serious lately...

apemonkeychimp - Feb 12, 2017 at 16:48
Seeing the photos of the Munich and London event, the Berlin one was a bit - how to put it - tense and overcrowded. I hope other people liked it better than me. Ron was busy signing stuff the entire time (of course, there were like 200 people there). I had a little chat with Jen, which was really nice as she really spread good mood and also TP collection cards. :)

But all in all it was a great chance to see the actual game - the demo was really cool: Someone was playing it on a big projector for everyone to see and when he was able solve a certain puzzle (which turned out to be a pretty cool joke) the entire audience applauded. That was really awesome. :)
Also it was a great chance to see Ron and Jen in person. Thanks again. :)

Simon Simon - Feb 13, 2017 at 05:35
Oh indeed is was quite crowded... which made me feel a bit uncomfortable. But then it was just awesome to be there, and especially Jenn was so amazing!

Mister T - Feb 15, 2017 at 07:01
The Berlin one might have needed more "attractions". I liked seeing Ron and Jenn, and I watched the game getting played through on the big screen (as well as on the small one), but afterwards it was kind done. Which worked fine for me, as I did not want to stay all evening and other people wanted in as well, but of course some Q&A with a mic or something like that could have been interesting as well.

Nonetheless I am amazed how much attention went into the events, the cards, the organisation and of course the presentation of the demo. Also interesting how the game appeared on the radar of many sites and youtubers. The presence of the designer is just something one cannot replace even with all the power of the internet.

Graeme Chicken - Feb 12, 2017 at 12:42
A fantastic night! Well and truly have me awaiting the game even more!!

Just hoping you accidentally hit the release button over the next week or so. That'd be pretty sweet!

Paul Jacobson - Feb 12, 2017 at 12:45
Thanks for setting this all up, I know it was a promo tour but I had lots of fun met some great people.
I already have my cards framed and on the wall =)
Really enjoyed the demo, can't wait for the full game.

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 12, 2017 at 13:32
I'm so sad I couldn't be there! :-(
Ron looks very huggable! :-)

Sushi - Feb 13, 2017 at 16:23
Ron, huggable?? I'd rather hug Jen... (looking lovely as ever)
Anyway... erm... I mean she's our new hope for adventure games in next half century... this may be an underexposed part of Thimbleweed Park: there are a lot of (relatively) young talents working together with the old masters. Let's hope they stay as likeable as they are now! (Making a new game every three years or so is a good start)

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 16, 2017 at 16:02
Yes, Ron is like a teddy bear. Although I understand if you would rather hug Jen.
The Point is strong with her so it's a good thing she belongs to a new generation.

Jassen Payen - Feb 12, 2017 at 13:54
Such a great night in London, was a real pleasure getting to meet Ron!

Played the demo and absolutely loved it.  So much better and polished than I'd expected.  It feels like it has captured the feeling of point and clickers from way back when, but with a fancy modern luster.  It's hard to explain unless you play yourselves.

I'm immensely excited to play the game in full and cannot wait.  Thanks again for everything and wish the team all the very best on the upcoming release of Thimbleweed Park.

Rob Miles - Feb 12, 2017 at 14:01
Great night :-) The game looks great, can't wait for release day! Good to meet everyone too

dada - Feb 12, 2017 at 14:29
:-D I love the three headed monkey!

Nor Treblig - Feb 12, 2017 at 21:03
Me too!

But I have the feeling that somewhere two monkey corpses are hidden...

Simon Simon - Feb 12, 2017 at 14:37
Wow, I am very happy to see all the recent press coverage!
It is quite interesting to see how people react that are not die-hard adventure game fans that loved all the old Lucas Arts games. I read comments on one German forum (see link) where some people stated they were not interested because of the bad graphics and the outdated, bulky "try&error" interface, even though the story might be compelling. Although I tend to think "I know it better, it is not outdated at all", I wonder how people with this perception - which is probably based on memories of frustrating adventure game experiences, and the reading of review articles plus some screenshots, but not actual playtesting TWP - could be convinced to at least give the game a try?

I am aware that there is no publicly available preview. I wonder if you plan to release some sort of free tiny demo of the game, were people can experience the UI and all the modern aspects of the game themselves? Just asking because I am curious - of course there are tons of videos around, but watching a video where someone celebrates the renaissance fair is just so different from experiencing in person that the interface is not bulky at all and the graphics are really charming (esp. the interface). I guess I just have been living in my kickstarter-devblog-bubble where everyone already loves the concept of this game, and I just wonder how many people outside this community will actually decide to play it.  The preview at the fan event was so mesmerizing - the UI, the graphics, the music, the story - although I had thought that I was kind of prepared, it was stunning.

I was a bit disappointed by some German press articles/reviews which did not really highlight that the game will be translated and interviews were lacking subtitles (or similar). I will play the English version anyway, but I see potential to even more highlight that the game is localized. Maybe a press kit which includes some screenshots of the localized UI could help to promote the translated versions? Also, by the way, will the Xbox/console UI be an (optional) part of all versions?

Thank you again for the Berlin fan event, Jenn and Ron. It was fantastic that you took the time.

Ron Gilbert - Feb 12, 2017 at 16:18
Well said.  This is our biggest concern. The game is easily discounted as just being a "retro fan game". I'm not convinced that a demo solves this problem without creating a lot more. We have "top people" working on it. It might be that the game needs a little time to "take off". We might see a slower ramp in sales as word-of-mouth builds.

Good catch with the translated screen shots, we'll be adding those now.

Dieter - Feb 12, 2017 at 17:10
Keep an eye on the mobile versions (from the marketing point of view). Adventure games are very popular on Android and iOS. AFIAK the Broken Sword series sold very well on the mobile platforms. So after the release of the PC and XBox versions and finishing the mobile versions you should do new marketing activities focused on the mobile versions. This should push the sales on PC and consoles too.

Stefan - Feb 13, 2017 at 01:25
I think that is very important!   I will be buying the game on xbox, Mac and iOs when it comes out.   They should never underestimate how easy this type of game plays on a mobile device.   If you remember, Monkey Island 1 & 2 briefly appeared on mobile devices and it played BEAUTIFULLY.    I cannot wait to see the banner for Thimbleweed Park in the App Store's Featured page.

Carlo Valenti - Feb 12, 2017 at 17:59
That is also our biggest concern: we want more of your games. Thank you for trying hard

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 13, 2017 at 03:43
I don't know.
From my personal experience, talking with friends and acquaintances who usually (or even occasionally) play games nowadays, I can group four categories of people:
1) "ol... err... experienced adventure game players": they want TWP. Everyone. Of course, they loved at last one Lucasfilm adventure game of the past.
2) "old people who never wanted to play an adventure game": Doom, GTA, Cannon Fodder, Turrican were their favourite games. They are not interested in TWP, even after having watched a funny trailer of the game.
3) Millennials who likes to try every sort of new game (like me, at their ages): 80% enjoyed the trailer, most of them are attracted by Ransome because of his swearing. The remaining 20% says that the game is too challenging, there is too much to think and too less to shoot.
4) Millennials who are stick to certain categories of games (soccer or shoot-em-up): they seem indifferent at the trailer. No reaction, no smiles. Probably they don't know what is it, but they are not interested to discover it, too.

What to do? As for me, with millennials (mostly tweens) I will share with them my positive feelings about TWP, week after week, until they will be convinced to purchase the game.
For category 2, I think there is no much to do.

About the price of the game: please note, category 4 usually as their parents to purchase one game each 3-4 months, because the price is high (50 or 60 euros, we are talking about FIFA, COD or UNCHARTED).
"Choose [the price] wisely" (cit.)

Big Red Button - Feb 13, 2017 at 04:29
"there is too much to think and too less to shoot."

This reminds me of an anecdote by David Fox. Rescue on Fractalus originally had no fire button, but when George Lucas playtested the game, he ordered him to add one. :-D
Watch here: https://youtu.be/T23NYPxPpHY?t=19m22s

Big Red Button - Feb 13, 2017 at 05:26
In Blade Runner (1997), you were able to shoot. So, there are ways to add something like this in an adventure game as well, but it would affect the age rating of the game, of course.

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 13, 2017 at 06:17
Tweens can understand that shooting is not the only way to have fun.
Maybe they simply don't know.
P.S.: there is a circus, there is a shoot-a-duck game... I hadn't the chance to, but maybe Ransome can shoot at the ducks!

Big Red Button - Feb 13, 2017 at 07:31
A shoot-a-duck game would pay homage to Sam & Max, I think. According to Ron, there will also be some playable arcade games in TWP.

By the way, back in the 90s, I had a friend who found adventure games to be boring, even though Sam & Max and DOTT were his first PC games at all. But, for whatever reason he liked to play Wak-A-Rat in Sam & Max. When we met, he used to suggest to play Wak-A-Rat more often than he suggested to play Sam & Max. Well, Sam & Max left me cold as well, but I don't know what he liked about Wak-A-Rat. Over the years I gave up trying to convince him of what makes adventure games fun, even though he also owned DOTT, which, in my opinion, was a great game. We broke tie years ago because we didn't get along. He was depressive and he seemed to dislike most of his games. However, some people will never get to like adventure games, but fortunately they seem to be a minority.

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 07:50
Also in Sam&Max by Telltale you could shoot at everything, having unlimited ammo.

It didn't affect ratings.
Max did. :-)

Paul - Feb 13, 2017 at 12:07
"old people who never wanted to play an adventure game": Doom, GTA, Cannon Fodder, Turrican were their favourite games."

I remember playing Wolfenstein 3D when it first came out... I played it for about 15-20 minutes, then I was like, "this is boring, you just go around shooting stuff, there is no real interaction with anything in this world... who would want to play a game like this?"
Lots of people, as it turns out.

Big Red Button - Feb 17, 2017 at 12:37
Those games have been played primarily via LAN, for all I know. On multiplayer mode, such shooters can be fun. But, I would never call them my favorite games either.

Well, it would have been great, if there was a reasonable way to play a classic point & click adventure (such as TWP) on multiplayer. It would have been a promising market niche, if such a mode got promoted sufficiently.

Nor Treblig - Feb 17, 2017 at 13:22
Once TWP is released we just reimplement it in Habitat et voilà: multiplayer TWP and C64 support.
Although it's probably more niche than market...

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/276548/Source_code_for_Lucasfilm_Games_80s_MMO_Habitat_released.php

Big Red Button - Feb 17, 2017 at 16:04
I'm pretty sure that there actually was a market for such a game back in the 90s, when Doom was killing adventure games. I still remember, when I frequently played multi-player games via LAN with my friends many years ago, I sometimes wondered why there had never been a multi-player point & click game. Seeing the success of MMORPGs and the Lego games, I'm not sure if there really isn't a certain demand for such a game nowadays.
Of course, it would be the first point & click game of its kind and designing it would be a big challenge. Also, I'm not sure how it would have to be done, but for exactly this reason it would probably be a revolutionary game. So, why not?
Unfortunately, such a project would necessitate a high budget, because you would need a server infrastructure, if you didn't want to restrict it to LAN. Also, internet security would be an important aspect.

Simon Simon - Feb 13, 2017 at 08:35
Thank you for your answer Ron. I see your point about a demo. I really hope that the game sells well and also stays in the media for a while.
You all are probably right about the importance of the mobile versions and also their marketing. I was not really aware of the fame of mobile gaming, and adventure games seem to be a well working genre for those platforms. I also recall Brooke Condolora mentioning on twitter that the iOS sales of Burly Men At Sea were quite significant compared to the Steam sales. Mobile platforms all the way! I am really curious how the final mobile UI of TWP will look and feel. I can imagine that some innovative adaptions to the interface (tapping, maybe some XBox-style hotspot interaction?) can really make the game feel natively designed for those devices.

DZ-Jay - Feb 15, 2017 at 05:32
:: Well said.  This is our biggest concern. The game is easily discounted as just being a "retro fan game".

But it is, in fact, a "retro fan game."  That was the entire point of making a 1987-ish style video game.  The concern then is, will a younger audience (or those who really don't have the fascination with the genre) connect with it?

There is no shame in embracing the fact that the game was made by 1980s adventure gamer designers for 1980s adventure gamers.  You just need to find a way to convey that this is a good thing and that the game may have a lot to offer to anybody else as well.  Arguing that the game is some modern masterpiece which considers modern world's sensibilities and invites modern world players, will only get you summarily dismissed as soon as someone takes a look at the graphics style.  Yes, it may be a shallow first impression, but it is the most important impression that matters.

    -dZ.

Altobee - Feb 12, 2017 at 14:59
I cant wait for the 17th of Soon... i think a german sound would be Great with a Bavarian dialect at some characters ;)

But ... at first finish the Game in this Version. I'm looking forward to a Update  function with german sound in the Future ;) We Germans will help you

Nor Treblig - Feb 12, 2017 at 21:08
This reminded me of another game with German dialects: https://youtu.be/ZDrmy49laP8?t=470 (Berliner dialect I think).

Herr Stirz - Feb 13, 2017 at 01:43
Hmmm. Sounds like Saxon, nice. Definitely improves every talky version of a German game. In this case, some pieces of Ruhr accent cannot be left out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wih_4DezlZc

Cheers,

Herr S.

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 07:55
Oh OK, I'm not an expert in German dialects :-)
I've thought of Berlin when hearing a lot of "Isch" but now I realise it should have been "Ick"!

Simon Simon - Feb 13, 2017 at 07:56
The German talkie of Simon the Sorcerer 2 also featured some nice dialects, e.g. the beachcomber (Strandsammler) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsrmYouIHao&t=14m1s

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 08:03
Oh yeah, I remember him! What a strange guy :-)

(I really have to replay StS 1&2 soon, it's been a long time! But now I'm not sure anymore which language to choose :-)

Simon Simon - Feb 13, 2017 at 08:57
If you have the choice I recommend a language which you have not played before as both the original English text and the localized versions are are really well done (at least the German translation is spectacular). So both the localized and the English versions are quite fun; also note that both games have talkie versions.
I re-played both games recently and I was somehow amazed how different my adventure game perception changed nowadays compared to what it was 20 years ago. I still found the music and character animations of StS quite spectacular, but I have read and experienced so much about good vs bad puzzle design, dependency charts, linear stories and anticlimatic endings that I tend to evaluate those aspects a lot more during playing than I did in the past. I am also spoiled with horizontal scrolling & parallaxing, and sometimes the background in StS feel quite static, like walkable images. However it is still a fun game to play, especially the first part imo; also the setting is cool. - I wonder what kind of setting a future Terrible Toybox adventure game might have, if there will be one.

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 13:44
I've played both languages, but the German one has been so long ago I guess I will now choose German again (which I normally don't do, I only play German if it's the original language, else English).

Regarding puzzles: as soon as I play the game and visit the places I will remember most of the puzzles (I think I have played Disworld the second time without a walkthrough, which is quite an achievement if you know the game!).
This means it's quite hard for me to reevaluate puzzles of games I've already solved some time ago...

From screenshots I've recently seen of StS I must say it still looks so gorgeous!

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 13:46
Oh and I really hope TWP will be financially successful (my hope is on mobile market). There should be a lot more games from Terrible Toybox in the future!

Gffp - Feb 13, 2017 at 16:02
Long live Terrible Toybox!!!

Carlo Valenti - Feb 13, 2017 at 17:41
yeah

LogicDeLuxe - Feb 13, 2017 at 08:37
Yuck! The completely unnecessary low quality of Simon 2 nags me every time. It would have fitted on CD the same quality the first game had.
I wish the German Hi-Fi patch were available already. SimSaw got in contact with Adventuresoft years ago and are allowed to release the patch. I remastered everything, except for two scenes where the original recordings are lost. SimSaw wants to rerecord the missing scenes, but I have no idea when this happens, if ever.

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 13:48
....is it possible to "find" this remastered patch (excluding those lost scenes) somewhere?

LogicDeLuxe - Feb 13, 2017 at 15:37
Unfortunately it isn't. SimSaw decided against it. I suggested this myself. But he didn't want to release the remastered voice acting when it is incomplete.
MojoTouch is a licensee and he was interested in the remastered voice acting for the Android version. Unfortunately, he wasn't willing to pay us, thus that version has no remastered voice acting either.
Of course, our PC patch is still planned to be a free fan patch for non-commercial use.
Also keep in mind that this will be German only. Any of the original English recordings are believed to be lost too.

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 17:08
That's a pity. I hope it will be released sometime.
Personally I'm fine with German only :-)

Johnny Walker - Feb 12, 2017 at 16:13
London was great! Meeting Ron was fantastic! Finally got the answer to some questions that had been in my head since 1992. And learned a neat new lesson to carry around; Shakespeare wrote hits!

Especially grateful to Jenn for being so friendly and welcoming. She helped make the event as enjoyable and fun as it was.

Looking forward to Thimbleweed Park even more now!

Dieter - Feb 12, 2017 at 16:17
Ron, what kind of achievement do I get after buying 10 copies?

Miguel - Feb 12, 2017 at 16:44
It was a fantastic night! Thank you guys for the opportunity to meet the team and see the game first-hand. Amazing that so many people turned up, but that made me not want to steal too much of Ron's time seeing the queue behind me to discuss technicalities about Scumm and the like.

I know this must've been a common feeling across the people who attended, but I really feel that MI somehow shaped my life, what I do for a living and the type of games I enjoy; and meeting Ron and being able to physically say "thank you" felt like a big life achievement.

Also, met a few really interesting people that made my night :-) As someone mentioned I was really surprised at how welcoming and open the team was. So looking forward to explore the game from home!

BoTToX - Feb 12, 2017 at 17:27
Release ????

Paul - Feb 12, 2017 at 19:48
I saw a German video with Ron where they played the demo with all the voice acting in it and it sounded fantastic! Really great job at nailing all of that, it really brings it to life.

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 12, 2017 at 22:28
Do you have a link to the video?!

Simon Simon - Feb 13, 2017 at 02:46
This is the video I think, with Gronkh, who is famous for his German let's play videos. The video itself is in English: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jqDBfg0FWI0
Second part: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lr18KsVWOoE
Be careful, they don't play the preview but portions of the actual game in casual mode, and there are quite some perviously unseen rooms, dialogues, puzzles in the video. SPOILER alert! I stopped watching it after a while. (Ray leaves the first location at 7:35, if you have seen the very first spoiler-alert preview video that Ron posted here quite some time ago - it is a bit similar until 12:35, then there are new locations & the newspaper location at 14:27. They browse the phonebook at 17:15 and call one number. Ransome flashback starts at 21:00)

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 13, 2017 at 03:03
Me too, I just whatched the video here and there, then I stopped.
On the other hand, when I played the public demo, I was so entrapped that I wanted to investigate every nook and cranny, and to push every pushable... things :-)
To watch is different than to play, that's all.

Paul - Feb 13, 2017 at 09:42
The one I saw was a different one, it's here -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXUf3fvzFfM
Gonna go watch the Gronkh one now!

Simon Simon - Feb 13, 2017 at 17:44
Cool, thanks for the link. I have not seen this one.

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 16, 2017 at 16:04
The video was gone before I could watch it... :-( Did Ron complain about it so it got removed?

longuist - Feb 16, 2017 at 18:11
It was this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MTgZsFKPmM
I guess it was removed because Mr. Milagros Aiken just copied it from the official channel

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 20, 2017 at 12:08
Thank you! :-)

Nor Treblig - Feb 12, 2017 at 21:10
https://storage.googleapis.com/images.thimbleweedpark.com/london_event4.jpg

Oh what a nice (=evil) idea to let Ron sign that toilet paper this way.
I assume he spent the rest of the evening unrolling and rewinding the paper...

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 12, 2017 at 22:30
It's the correct way to use toilet paper!

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 13, 2017 at 03:05
A friend of mine, looking at that picture, commented: "he should have signed it even on the other side!"

Nor Treblig - Feb 13, 2017 at 08:00
Oh and to clarify: With "he" I meant Ron, unwinding all the toilet paper after realising he signed it the "wrong" way (= the actual correct way).

I still have the feeling Ron will leave the wrong way as default... there will be a lot of discussion at game release... :-)

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 16, 2017 at 16:08
I'm very afraid that Ron will leave the wrong way as default! :-(

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 16, 2017 at 16:58
If he leaved the correct way, none would change it through the options.

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 20, 2017 at 12:10
That is hopefully true!

Felix - Feb 13, 2017 at 05:54
There's only one correct way to sign toilet paper.

Zombocast - Feb 13, 2017 at 00:22
This is the best article i've read yet, careful spoilers (PC GAMER)
http://bit.ly/2kJ8j4U

Stefan - Feb 13, 2017 at 01:42
I am almost more excited about the new podcast than I am about the game! This really is my most anticipated game ever, and I do hope they still have a physical game box available.   They want us to play the game "how we remember" it, and I certainly remember those game boxes!

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 13, 2017 at 02:56
Who is the GENIUS of the 6th picture?? :-D

Bogdan Barbu - Feb 13, 2017 at 10:10
How much of a genius can he be if he can't even orient the toilet paper properly? :D

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 13, 2017 at 13:27

Bogdan Barbu - Feb 13, 2017 at 20:31
I know about the patent; this crowd in particular is probably weird enough to posses such useless information. I was just looking for a humorous flame. :) But if you have pets, you might want it to go on the inside just to avoid them unrolling the paper.

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 14, 2017 at 01:23
Eheh you are right. Look at this:
https://youtu.be/KN_9M-6B8Zs

Nacho Fernandez - Feb 13, 2017 at 08:46
A pity I can't make it to any of these meetings, they look like a lot of fun.
And a honest question, no offense meant and excuses to my wife and Mr Sandercock: Is Jenn so goodlooking in person as she appears in pictures?

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 13, 2017 at 10:10
She is better than she appears in pictures!

Jen Starar - Feb 13, 2017 at 09:55
Amazing fan event! Wonderful to play the demo, felt so good and looked so good. So great to meet Ron and have a good chat with him! He graciously signed my Monkey Island 2 Amiga box and other stuff. Best evening out ever :D Can't wait for the full game!

Gv - Feb 13, 2017 at 20:32
I hope you had fun!
<advertising>
I finished my Indiana Jeans game. I needed to say it.
</advertising>

Gromish - Feb 14, 2017 at 05:30
Release time is coming, waiting for Linux flavour...
Need some blog post about state of things!

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 14, 2017 at 08:10
Italian users: here is the well-written IGN article ("Thimbleweed Park Is Secretly an Open-World Point 'n' Click Game") translated in italian, from IGN.it:
http://it.ign.com/thimbleweed-park-pc/121629/preview/thimbleweed-park-e-un-gioco-punta-e-clicca-open-world

Gabarts - Feb 14, 2017 at 10:37
Lol! Now that roll of paper has a value! It's a permanent inventory item!

Mauro Gaspar - Feb 14, 2017 at 14:07
Hello I`m from Argentina. As a kid I played every graphic adventure game there was and i`m a big fan of monkey island and maniac mansion. I can`t wait to play Thimbleweed Park!! is there an official release date?? I`ll buy ten copies of course! :)

Carlo Valenti - Feb 14, 2017 at 18:32
Absurd scenario: what if TWP is not the perfect shoot'em'up as we are all expecting it to be?
By the way, can't wait to see the extra-armour powerups and giga-ammos. And the final level boss.
Still can't understand what a cursed clown has to do with it.

Gffp - Feb 14, 2017 at 19:24
Don't think about it, just shoot him up!!! Cursed zombie mutant jackass clown. What a boss!!! And I'm expecting a lot of scantily clad women as well!!!

Nor Treblig - Feb 15, 2017 at 05:28
What are you talking about? I thought this is a breakout clone.

Mister T - Feb 15, 2017 at 06:43
I just hope it does not turn out to be a rogue-like. Rogue-likes are for developers too lazy for level design.

asterothe - Feb 14, 2017 at 18:34
when is the release date? I read a 17th on the page... Is it true???

Brian Small - Feb 14, 2017 at 18:38

asterothe - Feb 14, 2017 at 18:53
thanks for this. it sounds like it will be released this Friday? OMG!!!!!!! I'm really excited now.

Nor Treblig - Feb 15, 2017 at 05:29
17th being the week and soon meaning not the current, but immediate following year?
This means 2018-04-29 at the latest, yay!

Gffp - Feb 15, 2017 at 05:59
Oh yes, the 17th year of the third millennium. As the spiritual successor of Maniac Mansion that it is meant to be, Thimbleweed Park is scheduled to be released exactly thirty years after it, on October 2017. Any eventual moving up of the date will be all and only a result of the team feverish work. And you don't want they die for a fever, right?

Arto - Feb 15, 2017 at 15:34
No, it's not the 17th of this month. The release date is about two weeks after they announce it.

Gffp - Feb 15, 2017 at 17:05
Yes, that's the truth, as confirmed above as well by the Authority here. While waiting I'm trying to shift desire with untrue and sometimes improbable (I hope also funny) facts. I hope some tens of thousands people come here with the same answer in mind: when will the game come out?

Nina - Feb 14, 2017 at 19:58
Looks like an wonderful night! The photos are great!

Gabarts - Feb 15, 2017 at 03:04
I think I'll buy one copy for PS4 (3 months waiting!), will be fun to see how many toilet paper or maniac mansion or monkey related achievements will pop up, lol! :)

Ron Gilbert - Feb 15, 2017 at 09:17
Please keep in mind that the MS exclusive runs out in 3 months. There is no guarantee the PS4 version will be done by then, and we don't even have a deal or devkits yet, so there is a lot that can go wrong and move that date out.

Mario F. - Feb 15, 2017 at 05:02
@RON
As a backer , what game Version do i get and how many? I mean the PC version is crystal clear. But since i own a xbox one i also would like to play on console. Do i need to pay again for the xbox one game? Or how is that solved?

Cheers

Nor Treblig - Feb 15, 2017 at 05:28
Out of the 9 additional copies you are obliged to buy anyway you can choose like 5 for XBox and 4 for PC.
Hooray!

Ron Gilbert - Feb 15, 2017 at 09:20
Backers get the Mac, Win and Linux version (DRM free or via Steam).  The Xbox and mobile version will need to be purchased.  Microsoft and Apple have no way to distribute free versions to backers.  Plus the cost of developing the Xbox version was not paid for with Kickstarter money.

Chippants - Feb 15, 2017 at 10:53
You had mentioned that once it's released we can get a copy for the PC on Steam, is that where I need to focus my attention to get my hands on a copy? It is not even mentioned there yet and I don't want to miss out on the release. =/

Also would just like to share that my guy is the one that shared Monkey Island with me 2 years ago and sat beside me laughing while I bumbled about not knowing what to do. I actually managed to find the treasure without understanding the dance steps were directions. His jaw dropped at the improbability and of course I was hooked.

We are so excited for this release and are supporting you and your team 100% ! Take care! =)

LogicDeLuxe - Feb 15, 2017 at 12:44
I've got a Humble Bundle claim link when the kickstarter succeeded. I have it in my account since Dec 12, 2014.
It states "Cross-Platform and DRM-Free". No mention about Steam though.

Ron Gilbert - Feb 15, 2017 at 12:50
That's odd. I don't know why you would have gotten that. We're not using Humble for our DRM free versions. When the game is release, all backers will get an email saying how to get the game.

LogicDeLuxe - Feb 15, 2017 at 13:55
I guess, it's because you offered backer payment through Humble Bundle for those who couldn't use Kickstarter at the time. This is probably their way to sent you the invoice.
It is listed under "Purchases", as "Thimbleweed Park (Tier 1) December 12, 2014 $25.00"
And clicking on it opens a page reading:
This page is claimed by you.
Thanks for purchasing Thimbleweed Park (Tier 1)!
When available, you'll be able to get all your digital content listed below right here on your download page!
Your purchase of Thimbleweed Park (Tier 1) gets you:
Thimbleweed Park, Cross-Platform and DRM-Free

Ron Gilbert - Feb 15, 2017 at 14:03
Interesting. I never saw those. Well, backers will get a new email with instructions for getting the game, but it sounds like where might be a small customer service issue we'll have to deal with. Thanks for the heads up.

Nor Treblig - Feb 15, 2017 at 16:15
...an email telling how to get a GOG key I hope :-)

Big Red Button - Feb 15, 2017 at 19:20
Well, I dislike copy protection, too, but I nonetheless wonder what's exactly the advantage of a DRM free version, if a Steam key would also work? How does the trustable consumer notice the difference, if he doesn't happen to intend to pirate the particular game?
Does it mean that we will be able to download the game once and archive it at home, so that we would still have the game even if the online store didn't exist any more one day?
Well, I think that a real fan is going to buy the boxed version of TWP anyway once it get's released, isn't she/he?

Nor Treblig - Feb 16, 2017 at 02:04
1. Steam key can mean anything. (Steam doesn't bother mentioning DRM or type of DRM anywhere.) I don't intent to install malware voluntarily (e.g. Denuvo).

2. In one hundred years I can fire a VM up and install the game e.g. using the installer from GOG. This may work with DRM-free Steam games too, but I have to archive it myself and hope there is no special additional configuration necessary. And that it really doesn't need a connected Steam account etc. to run.

Crackers do us a favour, allowing us to preserve games for history. I'm sure there are a lot of current generation games which will be lost forever because they require a server part which will never be released when the servers are shutdown (e.g. see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darkspore).

Big Red Button - Feb 16, 2017 at 06:44
@ Nor Treblig: I see. Thank you for this explanation!
Though, a DRM free game can also rely on a server, can't it? For example, a few months ago, we discussed with Ron about analytics (e.g. for the achievements), which TWP is going to send to a server ( https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/final_phonebook_import ).

Nor Treblig - Feb 16, 2017 at 07:16
If it relies on the server then it's DRM!

Of course you can have online or multiplayer components relying on servers in DRM-free games. But the rest of the game needs to work regardless or it's DRM.

Big Red Button - Feb 16, 2017 at 14:34
I see. Thanks!

Ron Gilbert - Feb 15, 2017 at 12:49
When a release date is announced, you will read about it everywhere. When the game is ready to be bought/downloaded, there will be a huge PR push, so it's unlikely anyone will miss it.

Paul - Feb 15, 2017 at 14:30
A huge PR push... wait, wait, wait, that doesn't sound very indie-developer style to me... I think you're meant to just tweet about the release once and then act totally flummoxed when it doesn't result in millions of sales. That seems more like the standard modus operandi.

LogicDeLuxe - Feb 15, 2017 at 16:32
It seems to be a little known fact that Steam games can be DRM free too. And those are not only the games running inside DOSbox. Although, obviously you aren't gonna get the Steam achievements or the Workshop functionality when running them without the Steam client.
Here is a list: http://pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_Big_List_of_DRM-Free_Games_on_Steam

Nor Treblig - Feb 15, 2017 at 17:10
There are a lot of different kinds of DRM.
Some consider Steam itself DRM since (on Windows) you have to install a Windows service running with superuser rights just to download a game. Even when games itself are DRM-free this may not be acceptable for some people.

I personally don't buy games on Steam anymore because I can't be bothered anymore with checking if those games are broken by design or not.

GOG FTW!

LogicDeLuxe - Feb 15, 2017 at 17:28
GOG is my first choice, too. Unfortunately, in some cases, developers decided to treat their Steam version better than GOG or even the retail CD (if it doesn't contain the Steam version anyway), ie. Steam gets issues patched while the other versions remain buggy.

When the Steam version is the only reliable option, I'll certainly wait until I get the game really cheap, while I would have spent significantly more on GOG or Humble Bundle, when they offer it DRM free.

Nor Treblig - Feb 16, 2017 at 02:00
Deploying an update via Steam is easy so I can understand it being first. Also I'm OK with Steam users being beta testers :-)
But if an update gets very late or even never released on other distribution platforms it sucks.

I've also seen so called "DRM-Free Editions" of games (even on GOG!), e.g. a game being stripped of the level editor; no (local) highscore being shown after a race (because they completely removed all the leaderboard related stuff) etc.

DZ-Jay - Feb 15, 2017 at 05:37
Mr. Gilbert,

Is there a release date yet?  I can't wait to play this game.  Although I will gladly wait for you to finish it and do it right.  Well, at least a little bit.  I don't want to wait too long.  But I rather wait than to get a half-finished game.  (For just a little while, I don't like waiting).  So, finish it already so that I don't have to wait.  But make sure it's done before releasing it, we'll wait (if only for a bit).  Just don't make me wait too long.

Anyway, you know what I mean.

     -dZ.

Chippantsq - Feb 15, 2017 at 11:24
I don't think there is a line at the moment for Call of Duty...

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 15, 2017 at 06:28
I miss the podcast ;-(

...I guess I should provide my own version of it...

Arto - Feb 15, 2017 at 15:37
Me too. I have no clue what the weather is like in SF and Seattle. I could check a weather service, but they are not that trustworthy.

realDonaldDuck - Feb 16, 2017 at 09:21
The so-called weather service is highly overrated.
It's all FAKE-NEWS!

Daniel - Feb 15, 2017 at 14:20
What a fantastic night! Thank you guys! Ron, I hope you like the CD of my band. Take care!

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 16, 2017 at 12:31
I don't remeber if the following question has already been answered (Nor Treblig, I'm counting on you!).
About TWP savegame files: will be possible to save them in the cloud, or they will be saved locally only?
My concern is that I wish to play TWP on two machines. Maybe I can use an "account" or something that can identify me...

...or the easy other option is to purchase another copy of TWP, of course.
8 more left!

Nor Treblig - Feb 16, 2017 at 12:52
As far as I know cloud functionality of the current platform will be used.
E.g. XBox cloud or Steam cloud or iCloud. There is no interoperability between these different platforms.
The save game format itself should be compatible though.

This means on PC and maybe mobile platforms it should also be possible to use your own sync mechanism to keep the save game folders in sync (e.g. using DropBox etc.).

There was some discussion regarding custom cloud saves on this blog post: https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/thimble_phone

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 16, 2017 at 17:03
Great! I rememberd the discussion, but not the post!
You are a really Seeker Master, mr. Nor Treblig!!
Yeah yeah, I have two PCs, one at home and one portable, both with TinySoft Losedows™, I could use my Dropbox account to sync the TWP savegame between them.
Thank you!

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 16, 2017 at 17:42
Did someone ask Ron if he implemented dynamic fog that react to the playable character's movement?!

longuist - Feb 16, 2017 at 18:11
*BEEEEEEEEEEP*

Paul - Feb 16, 2017 at 19:38
I think that's being saved for the sequel, Thimbleweed Park 2: Dynamic Fog

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 17, 2017 at 03:14
I asked: "How's the weather on Thimbleweed Park?" ... and the asnwer was: "Sunny. Everywhere. Even at night. No room for fog".

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 20, 2017 at 12:12
Strange...

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 21, 2017 at 05:57
(I was joking! :-))

Arto - Feb 21, 2017 at 13:46
(Ron wasn't)

Nor Treblig - Feb 21, 2017 at 08:50
The weather is: light clouds with eternal sunset.

Stefan - Feb 17, 2017 at 02:02
How's that podcast coming along Ron?   The game I can wait for, the podcast not so much:)

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 17, 2017 at 03:17
the 17th of Soon is today.
Podcast and deliver!

longuist - Feb 17, 2017 at 09:12
And where is podcast 46? And fake podcast 46-3?

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 17, 2017 at 17:18
It's recorded.
I'm not going to edit it today, I'll do it tomorrow.

Read the above sentence tomorrow, thank you.

Ron Gilbert - Feb 17, 2017 at 09:19
It's recorded, I'll edit it Sat morning.

Dieter - Feb 17, 2017 at 10:27
Exactly two years ago Ron posted this video of TWP:

https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/ui_in_action

Amazing how the interface and the graphics evolved ...

Ron Gilbert - Feb 17, 2017 at 11:00
That clock is still in the game.

Dieter - Feb 17, 2017 at 11:03
In one of your next blog posts you could show how the scene evolved over the time/development process. It would be interesting to see how the graphics changed over the two years. :)

Daniel Wolf - Feb 17, 2017 at 16:12
I just got the latest c't from the mail (which is only *the* most respected and most read computer magazine in Germany). They had a full two-page article on Thimbleweed Park! It was very positive and did nothing to reduce my anticipation. To quote the end:

"The discomforting atmosphere and the strange characters make you curious. Something sinister is happening in this half-deserted town. You want to find out what -- even though the command via action verbs may not be up to date."

Nor Treblig - Feb 17, 2017 at 18:23
"even though the command via action verbs may not be up to date"

Sorry, but: asshats... (but maybe they only meant the UI representation and not the concept itself)

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 06:05
Nope, the UI of TWP *is* not up to date. There are more modern concepts even in adventure games.

Big Red Button - Feb 18, 2017 at 07:53
I think, the point is that they don't seem to appreciate the advantages of the verbs UI. Why ever.
They ought to have written: "Not least because" instead of "even though".

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 10:17
What are the advantages? Compared to a - let's say - "coin"interface or a menu like in Larry 7?

We like the UI in Thimbleweed Park because we grow up with this interface. But it is not a modern UI interface. I.e. it doesn't work intuitive.

Ron Gilbert - Feb 18, 2017 at 10:43
I.e. it doesn't work intuitive.

I completely disagree. Based on our playtesting, it's initial confusing, but once they get it (10 mins), it's 100% intuitive. All the options are right on the screen. There is this concept in design called "out of sight, out of mind".  By showing all the verbs and inventory, your options are always in front of you. It is a leap for some players to get over, but I don't find it unintuitive.

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 11:04
"Based on our playtesting, it's initial confusing"

Then it's not intuitive. ;-) A good UI isn't confusing, even in the first 10 minutes - which is a very long time, btw. I guess the most players that are "new" to adventure games will give up within this time. Today the "normal" gamer wants to start the game and just play.

In my(!) opinion a good rule of thumb is: If you need to explain the UI (or a manual), the UI is not intuitive.

Disclaimer: I like the verb interface due to the reasons you and Nor mentioned! So I'm on your side. :)

Ron Gilbert - Feb 18, 2017 at 11:09
Sorry, there is nothing intuitive about coin menus. The 10 minutes players spend getting used to our menu, is the same 10 minutes they would have spent with a coin menu. The problem we face is the same a black and white movies face. There is a initial prejudice. But... The Artist won best picture a few years back and Young Frankenstein is one of the best moves ever made. People get over it. I'm OK with that.

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 11:42
"The 10 minutes players spend getting used to our menu, is the same 10 minutes they would have spent with a coin menu."

I bet 500 dollars with you that this is not true. :)

Let's assume we have the coin interface and no manual. The player starts the game and sees the cursor. He is familiar with this thing from windows/macOS/whatever. So he moves the cursor around. If he moves over an object, the game highlights the object (i.e. like in TWP with a text above the cursor). The player knows this concept too - i.e. from his browser. The player is curious and clicks and voila - all possible actions will pop up. At this moment the player knows how to play the game - and it took less than 10 minutes. :)

Ron Gilbert - Feb 18, 2017 at 12:48
I bet 500 dollars with you that this is not true. :)

I'll bet you $1000 it is true, because I've watched it.  For someone that plays game regularly, the verb and coin interface is figure out in less than a minute. For people who don't play a lot of games, the coin interface is just as confusing as the verb interface.

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 18:18
"I'll bet you $1000 it is true,"

Ok, I agree and raise to $1000. If I lose, you get the $1000 from me, if you lose you don't have to pay.

"because I've watched it."

When and where? Have you done these tests? Under which conditions? With experienced players? (btw: does anybody knows if there are some research papers about this?)

"For someone that plays game regularly, the verb and coin interface is figure out in less than a minute."

That's true. But these players are willing to learn complex interfaces and they are more familiar with complex interfaces. It's like: If you know Microsoft Windows you are able to learn the macOS UI. But macOS hasn't a very intuitive UI (ask my mom :)). So only a group of experienced players isn't enough to classify a UI as intuitive.

(If you are interested in, we could talk about this topic via email.)

Nor Treblig - Feb 18, 2017 at 22:11
@Someone: This should be interesting if you haven't already seen it: https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/playtest

Someone - Feb 20, 2017 at 10:40
@Nor: Yes, I've seen it. But these tests are only with the verb interface. (Or have I overlooked something?) Regarding verb interface vs. coin interface: You have to do A/B tests with both interfaces and different groups of players.

Nor Treblig - Feb 21, 2017 at 08:54
@Someone: This blog post was about the very first real playtest by an outsider, and yes, verb-list-UI only.
They've made many more playtests and also they've seen the game played by press and on conventions.

They've seen it played with mouse and controller (e.g. on XBox events) so they should now have an idea how it resonates.

But they've never really (at least as we know of) tried/prototyped any other interfaces than this visible verb list (except special controller controls). Reason seems to be because Ron wants it that way and this also was a premise of the Kickstarter.
i.e. they don't have comparisons to e.g. a coin interfaces.

Btw. when the new style was introduced there was some discussion here: https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/stateofthegame3
(e.g. search for wheel)

Someone - Feb 22, 2017 at 05:17
"But they've never really (at least as we know of) tried/prototyped any other interfaces than this visible verb list (except special controller controls)."

Yes, and that is why I ask the questions above (in my post from Feb 18, 2017 at 18:18). I would like to know, if Ron has tried the coin interface in an older project or if he simply doesn't like the interface. If you test just one interface, you know only that this interface is working but not if there is another interface that is more intuitive. :)

I'm willing to write a short prototype adventure game with the verb interface, the coin interface and the sierra interface for A/B tests. (If Ron is interested in such a test and/or someone else supports me.)

And again the disclaimer: I don't like the coin interface!

Nor Treblig - Feb 22, 2017 at 15:30
@Someone: Wait until TWP is released then we can mod the tuna out of this game!

Someone - Feb 22, 2017 at 16:39
@Nor: No problem, there are nutcrackers out there (this sentence includes a very brilliant joke for Squirrel programmers.)

Nor Treblig - Feb 22, 2017 at 17:07
Which reminds me: It's always interesting to see how much of the UI is in the script and what is in the engine.

Someone - Feb 23, 2017 at 04:55
"Which reminds me: It's always interesting to see how much of the UI is in the script and what is in the engine."

Yes, I would like to know that too. If there are plans to reuse the engine in another project, it would be the best to put most of the UI code in scripts.

Ema - Feb 25, 2017 at 05:54
@Someone

I don't think your "private" discussion with Ron is productive. Maybe it would have been productive in the first phases of development.
Now the game is ready, and one of its objective was to be "a new classic point and click adventure - with verbs". Period.
And not a  "new classic point and click adventure - with a coin menu".

So what's the point in discussing this NOW? It's just a criticism to what it's done.
Ron Gilbert revolutioned the adventure game industry with the concept of the verb-based UI.
We are here beacuse of that. There's plenty of adventures with a coin (or, worst af all, a mouse-scrolling-icon sistem). But we don't want those.
is like saying, ie, "I don't share the choice of Sid Meier who made Civilization VI a strategy game based on turns. It would have been better a real time game". Or maybe "I don't like the realism and hardness of flight simulator X. I'd prefer cartoon physics, and lots of shiny stars, hearts and candies I can collect in the clouds to make a lot of score!"

It's like destroying the spirit of the game.

So, that's why this discussion is sterile. We are discussing about nothing.

And, if you want, I can give you my personal opinion on UIs:
understanding the verbs UI is simply grammar. You learned it at school. If you take more than 5 minutes to get it, you should go back to primary school again.
Maybe a native digital, who started using an iPad before learning how to read, could find the coin more suitable.
Anyway, I'll play TWP as I played all my Lucas adventures: mostly choosing actions with my keyboard.

Ciao.

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 20, 2017 at 12:34
I hate the coin interface!

longuist - Feb 20, 2017 at 16:04
I'm all in wif flaming dem stinkin' jeton interface. *beeep* off bugged bugger

Ron Gilbert - Feb 22, 2017 at 15:34
You'll never defeat the XOR 0x69 encryption. Never!

Nor Treblig - Feb 22, 2017 at 15:42
HA! It's probably just applied multiple times. I'll build GPU clusters to calculate it a gazilion times until the decrypted result contains "tunahead" somewhere, et voilà!

Someone - Feb 22, 2017 at 16:26

Nor Treblig - Feb 18, 2017 at 10:44
If you are talking about coin interface etc. then it's just the UI representation. It's OK to prefer different ones.

Btw. I do think the UI TWP is much more intuitive than other kinds of UIs, e.g. hidden in menus/coins, needing special gestures etc. WYSIWYG!

I think the main problem with TWPs interface is the looks which maybe some (younger?) audience wouldn't appreciate so much than us old farts.

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 11:20
"If you are talking about coin interface etc. then it's just the UI representation."

No, the representation and the concept are interrelated. They form together the UI.

In point and click adventures you could use the verb interface where you have to click the verb and then to click at the object. If you use the coin interface, you have to click first on the object, then the game gives you serveral actions to perform. That's a completely other interaction with the game (and not only another representation).

The coin interface is much more intuitive, because I don't have to explain to the player that he/she has to click on one verb. Instead the player just has the cursor. He/she has just to click at an object and then the game gives the player the possible options.

I do not say that the coin interface is better. It's different, but more intuitive.

And remeber: We know the verb interface from our childhood. We are familiar with it. So *we* find it intuitive.

Nor Treblig - Feb 18, 2017 at 12:44
I disagree that there is so much difference.

Also there is one misunderstanding: With "concept of verbs like in TWP" I meant having *a lot of verbs* to choose from. This can be implemented like it is in the current interface, using a coin interface or different way.
The purpose is to make the player think more what he want to do instead of randomly clicking on everything which is more feasible with one-verb (e.g. look/use in one action) or two-verb interfaces. (e.g. separate look and use actions)

If you look at DOTT Remastered: There is no real difference between the original interface and the coin interface, that's what I meant with different UI representation only (although the use is slightly different as you said).
(btw. there is one difference with the DOTT coin interface: it is context sensitive, i.e. it only shows "useful" verbs. But I don't like this particular implementation: I hate it when such "intelligent" menus change the position of commands! [muscle memory!])

Sushi - Feb 20, 2017 at 16:26
My initial reaction to the coin interface in MI3: "punch/slap, kill, bite?? Allright!"
My initial reaction to the coin interface in Full Throttle "punch/slap, kill, kick?? Allright!"
Still either way, I had no problem figuring it out.
On the other hand if you have an attention span of less than 10 minutes and/or cannot be persuaded to *read* some text in the form of a verb interface... well then maybe P&C adventure games just aren't your thing (you=modern game player, not you Someone). And neither are books. Hell, these books are even less intuitive, there is no "turn page" at the end - I was like stuck for like 5 minutes trying to figure out how to continue. For real. And where are the graphics in these books - the cover looked awesome, but there is only letters and words inside? What, I have to imagine what is being described? What a retarded form of self-proclaimed art is that? Surely that won't survive my time on earth! (modern game player  picks up smartphone and pays some micro-transactions to feed his 30 second hunger for accomplishment)  
Anyway, if said modern player does buy a copy and decide to drop it after 10 minutes over the UI... his/her loss. Sure, there will be some trolls posting reviews on Steam/Gog/... but they will be drowned by the love from the fans (tricking even more players into buying the game bwahahaha!)

Seriously: give the casual players and everyone who did not grow up playing these games some credit too! My kids love to play them as well, even if they suck at it and I need to restrain myself from helping them out and just help with the translating.

Sushi - Feb 20, 2017 at 16:29
I just realized that not only the terms "point and click adventure" and "cut-scene" are thanks to LFL adventures, but also "coin interface". Its because of that golden doubloon  in Curse of MI.

Nor Treblig - Feb 21, 2017 at 09:01
@Sushi:
In the bottom corners are numbers, e.g. bottom left "2", bottom right "3".
Any reasonable person should figure out this belongs to a sequence and will look for "4".
If you needed 5 minutes to figure it out with all those hints given there is no one to blame except yourself!!
:-)

Sushi - Feb 23, 2017 at 01:58
@nor treblig: "yeah, but the numbers were so well hidden. they did not flash in bright colors when I was near the end of the page"
"oh, and I would also like a balloon with TURN here"

Mattias Cedervall - Feb 20, 2017 at 12:38
Your so called reasoning is a failure! :-( That's like saying: "The steering wheel on a car isn't a modern interface so we must change that!" Some things doesn't automatically get worse when they age! Do you want modern not-round wheels on your car?!

Someone - Feb 23, 2017 at 07:46
I have to dissapoint you, but we have already not-round steering wheels. :) (Ok, most cars have still a round steering wheel.) And most car manufacturers are working on self driving cars - with no steering wheel! You will find this trend in adventure games too: Have a look at the one-click-interface in "Silence".

Nor Treblig - Feb 18, 2017 at 10:37
With UI representation I meant the verb GUI covering part of the screen. I could understand some people not liking it.
With concept I meant actually having verbs (like, plural!).

Do you have any specific modern concepts in mind?

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 11:32
If we are talking about point and click adventures, "modern concepts" are the coin menu (see the DOTT remake) or a "one click" interface like in "Silent" from Daedalic and the Broken Sword series.

I know, they are not "modern" but they came up after the LucasArts games and are used in todays adventure games. Players expect these "simplefied" UIs and that was meant in the article.

If you like a "modern" UI with verbs, have a look at Larry 7. They mixed the verb interface with the coin interface and the textadventure interface. :)

Nor Treblig - Feb 18, 2017 at 12:32
IMHO really intuitive UIs are OK for ticket machines but completely shitty if you actually have to use them for hours. There is nothing wrong with learning an interface.

All hail hotkeys!

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 18:30
Oh, I am willing to learn new interfaces and I don't like the coin interface too. But we are talking about "new" adventure game players and the mass of the (casual) players.

Today there are many players who are playing a game for only a few minutes. And if they aren't able to control the game or are able to figure out what to do, they quit the game. Telltale is very successful with "adventure games" that are very simple to control. And Daedalic has simplified the UI in "Silence" intentionally to get more customers.

Ron Gilbert - Feb 18, 2017 at 18:34
The verb interface is a perception issue, like making a modern black and white movie. The verb interface is part of our vision for the game, and it's not going to change.

Nor Treblig - Feb 18, 2017 at 22:15
You said it: "adventure" "games". I was horrified when I saw their Jurassic Park game (QTE galore). I didn't like the direction Telltale was going but I'm glad I got nice new Sam&Max and Monkey Island games until it was over.
They've still made and are making some nice story-based "games", but they are more like movies. (Movies with QTE, ugh.)

Have you seen this blog post about alternative TWP control schemes? https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/controllers

Someone - Feb 20, 2017 at 10:34
@Ron: I like the verb interface! (And there are serveral reasons for this.) The verb interface is one(!) of the many reasons I backed the project. But as you said: It's like a black and white movie. So the press(!) thinks that this interface is not up to date. (The only thing I have to disagree with you is, that a verb interface is less intuitive... ;-))

@Nor: I agree completely with you. The modern Telltale games are more like an interactive movie. But in the press and on steam they were mentioned and sold as adventure games. And the most (younger) players will imagine these games when thinking of "adventure games".

I've read the blog posts and I'm curious how good the Xbox controller will actually work. I'm a little bit sceptical, but I trust Ron. :) The best platform(s) for adventure games are beside the PC (in my opinion) Tablets and Smartphones because you can point with the finger on something. :)

Nor Treblig - Feb 21, 2017 at 09:11
I'm eager to see how the controls with a controller are implemented too!

What I often don't like with touch-only controls are the implementation of secondary actions. E.g. with mouse you often do a right click as shortcut for 'look at' or even much more (scrolling through inventory with mouse wheel for example).

Regarding 'adventure games': AFAIK this started much earlier! FPS which hasn't shooting as their main objective were already called 'adventure games' by some. There is something true in that of course, but it's not what we would ever call an adventure game :-)
That's why we often say 'point'n'click adventure game' to be more specific, but it's getting more and more complicated now: point'n'touch adventure game? controller-controlled-2D-non-platforming adventure game?

Trump - Feb 18, 2017 at 12:48
Coin interfaces are for losers, it has to be said. Verbs are tremendous, they do a great job, all the best adventure games use them.
There are bad people who want you to use the failing coin interfaces. Sad.

Maurizio - Mar 05, 2017 at 13:46
The coin interface? maybe the one with images instead of actions? Then the hand in that case is use or grab? who knows.... Confusing confusing confusing...

Big Red Button - Mar 05, 2017 at 18:31
Also, how to differ between "push" and "pull"?

Nor Treblig - Mar 05, 2017 at 19:14
StS2 used icons: http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/0/4938/209575-simon3.png
There is only 'move' but you could use the arrow to differentiate between 'push' and 'pull'.

Nor Treblig - Mar 05, 2017 at 19:36
Here's the 'push' from DOTT remastered: https://youtu.be/XAfbm-njvXA?t=1115
(you normally don't see 'push' and 'pull' there at the same time since it's context sensitive)

Big Red Button - Mar 05, 2017 at 20:08
@ Nor Treblig:
Thank you for those links! I still prefer verbs, because you can directly read what they mean. Furthermore, I dislike case sensitive interfaces in adventure games, because they take you by the hand. It's more fun to have to figure out yourself which verbs work on the particular item and which don't, especially if a useless combination leads to a joke!

Nor Treblig - Mar 06, 2017 at 02:05
@Big Red Button:
I especially don't like the context sensitivity in DOTT Remastered since the position of the verbs change.

What I like about icon verbs are that you can combine open/close so you can add other verbs (like 'wear' in StS) instead (well, you could do it with text too by changing the verb depending on the selected object).

Richard - Feb 17, 2017 at 21:47
Can't wait to pick up a copy of this!

Big Red Button - Feb 18, 2017 at 10:15
TWP page on Steam is up.

Ema - Feb 18, 2017 at 11:18

Someone - Feb 18, 2017 at 11:50
"Release Date: Spring 2017"

Nor Treblig - Feb 18, 2017 at 12:31
Well, this settles the year at least.

Thaddeus Sharpe - Feb 23, 2017 at 09:23
This blog post is not representative! I'd like to put in a formal complaint! The very flattering photo Finn took of me is not only the representation of what it is to be a fan of thimbleweed park, but surely a demonstration of masterclass photography and the beauty of the dichotomy of man. Here is the link for those of you who wish to see the truth, THE UNCENSORED BEAUTY
;)
http://i.imgur.com/jNpjzYe.jpg

Thaddeus Sharpe - Feb 23, 2017 at 09:28
PS
Event was amazing, thank you so much guys, loved playing through the demo!

PPS
CALL ME 7483 xxx

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 23, 2017 at 10:35
"For a good-time, call..."

Thaddeus Sharpe - Feb 23, 2017 at 14:18
You have no idea ;)

(But my wife does, that's by she looks so ashamed of me in the photo)

Nor Treblig - Feb 23, 2017 at 18:14
Oh, I've just now realised this is your actual phone number! You have to wait about a month until I'll get my landline.
Better be at home when I'll call!

Thaddeus Sharpe - Feb 26, 2017 at 19:17
(Are we role playing in game here?)
Yes that's my landline, visible in any good reputable phonebook ;)

Nor Treblig - Feb 26, 2017 at 21:33
Game? What game?
Let us talk via phone!

Gabarts - Feb 26, 2017 at 08:13
That's ridiculous! Someone is arguing a discussion about the best interface against the father of the SCUMM system? That's insane! It's like saying to Van Gogh he can't paint! Verb coin is not intuitive at all, plus is misdirectional. With classic verbs interface you have all under the sight, you immediately know by logic which is the correct action to perform.

Rather i'll say the Broken Sword I engine is a work of genius, which is still at top of my preferences for a point and click interface, but it's another style and another story.

I compare verb coin to automatic trasmission in car and classic interface to manual transmission, you feel the difference :) ...

Nor Treblig - Feb 26, 2017 at 09:07
Car analogies here we come!

I think your analogy is flawed since verb grid and verb coin are in the end more or less the same.
It's like the difference between between a traditional manual transmission and a sequential manual transmission. There are differences but in the end you have to shift manually.

An automatic transmission would be more like a single-click interface which automatically selects the appropriate verb (i.e. the action which the game designer had in mind).

Zak Phoenix McKracken - Feb 27, 2017 at 04:36
...and a driverless car is a cutscene.

Nor Treblig - Feb 27, 2017 at 22:36

Ema - Mar 05, 2017 at 10:24
And looking up a walkthrough is just like hiring a driver.

Gabarts - Feb 27, 2017 at 08:06
well, maybe it's not the most appropriate analogy, and I'm not saying that automatic is for noobs. So, for your point of view the Broken Sword engine is kinda automatic transmission :) Personally I like the adventure game in general so I don't care much of one interface or another, I liked Lighthouse, I liked Beneath a steel sky, Sierra games etc etc
but of course verb coin would be my second choice :)

Nor Treblig - Feb 27, 2017 at 17:21
I agree, they are different games and play differently. Doesn't mean they cannot be enjoyed just because of the interface (btw. I mostly use hotkeys anyway :-).

Yes, if I remember correctly Broken Sword would be an automatic transmission. Two verbs: action (use/pickup/talk/...) and look at.

Broken Age is another example and even more extreme: one-click (single verb) interface but still a classic point'n'click adventure (although some may disagree), no pixel graphics but complete with dialog trees, inventory etc. (hey, even multiple characters like MM, DOTT, TWP).

Nor Treblig - Feb 27, 2017 at 17:23
Oh, BASS was great, still hoping for BASS2 in pixel graphics!

I loved Lighthouse! It's a Myst-like game from Sierra and finally one where you cannot lose (easily). Similar to Zak McKracken it took me some time to realise its ingenuity. I've always thought I've hit dead ends but I was just too stupid :-)

Schala - Mar 23, 2017 at 03:48
Only now did I look through the pictures in this post. The toilet paper autograph made me laugh. :)
what is one + three + one?