One Last Entry
by Ron Gilbert
Mar 18, 2017
Mar 18, 2017
I know you're starting to tear up like I am, but our time together is coming to a close. It's been two years filled with joy, laughs, learning, and anxiety (mostly anxiety).
Before the game launches on the 30th, I'd like to do one more big dev blog post. Any suggestions?
And for those of you skeptical that we made any progress over the last two years, here is the first video of the game I posted.
- Ron
P.S. Just to clarify, we will continue to post on the blog after launch, but the posts will become less frequent, only when news shows up. Keeping the blog current is exhausting work.
Like an entire review process of the whole development. How you dealt with the continued unexpected.
P.S. I'd like to buy a Thimbleweed Park poster that has all the characters on it followed by your three autographs; but not expensive. This could help fund your next project!
Other topics that would be really great are how you do the writing, how you design puzzles (apart from dependency charts), composing the music, the new walk-box-algorithm, and how you implemented save-games in the end.
Does it mean that there won't be any future projects? That should be the topic of the next dev blog post.
I'm dying to know a tad bit less than I am to play the game.
Animations, special case animations, sketches, parallax, UIs, talkes, translations, backgrounds, programming, options...
... oh! The options! How many options there are in the game? :-)
Jokes apart, I think there are no more topics about game development that you didn't cover yet, since 01/01/2015.
So... how about a last podcast, where there is Ron, David, Gary, and other TWP member representatives, as many as possible?
They could tell us what is the most funny thing they did and the most boring one, for instance, in their specific area (background, programming, animations, music...)
Or...
...what about a lottery for our users of this very blog? The winner could join you in the podcast.
OK, back to reality...
You mean they should pick random posts until they get hold of one particular author who tried to increase his odds since the beginning? So this explains it all, this was your sinister plan after all! :-)
Won't you do mobile ports, etc.? Wouldn't there be announcements from time to time about this?
Or why not have a blog post about e.g. the porting process in a few months?
Of course it can be more quite here, but why stop?
Ps Don't forget to screw on the center-stick on your gamepad.
As for suggestions, how about a list of the key milestones, with pictures?
Or a list of the highs and lows?
(I like lists.)
Also, you used SCUMM VM earlier, but today you just use Squirrel for the same stuff. Is that correct? Do you think Squirrel works good, or would you have rather used more like a domain specific language for your engine? I'm thinking, you probably have a Squirrel library and a lot of conventions now instead of a DSL. I'd love to hear more about this. Also, how much code is in C/C++ compared to Squirrel nowadays? (Since the compile is rather fast, I'd guess you've got quite a lot of Squirrel code).
And finally, thank you *so* much for all the updates, posts and great podcast, and the game itself. I'm very excited, and I hope it'll be insanely successful. You deserve it! As for the last post, will you do a final podcast some time after release, to sum up everything?
Take care guys, and absolutely best of luck! Thank you so much!
Ron on the creation of SCUMM with UNIX tools:
http://www.pagetable.com/?p=603#comment-9453
The Influence of the UNIX Operating System on the Development of Lucasfilm Games:
http://www.langston.com/Papers/vidgam.pdf
About the Macross assembler:
http://www.pagetable.com/?p=848
Classic Studio Postmortem - Lucasfilm Games:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8AGwZ5mp_U
Lucasfilm Games/LucasArts - The Early Years (by David Fox):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqKf0Lu_EDU
I'm sure the blog will still be used to have follow ups on the DLC for uncensored Ransome, and announcing the next adventure game using the awesome engine of TWP :)
Until then please give some more little blog entries about the mobile dev and how the selling process goes on.
My question: Would you do it again and if so: how can we (the backers and the blog fans) participate. If not: how can change your mind? Seriously!
I want to say thank you for all the dev related articles you posted, they're very helpful for all indie devs, established and aspiring alike.
Here are a couple of suggestions for topics I would be interested to read about still
- How did you end up implementing save games when using a scripting language like Squirrel (assuming you were using their embedded interpreter rather than your own, I might be wrong in that regard)?
- You talked about dialogue trees and a format for them in one article, but I am also interested in the rendering of the fonts.
The common style these days is to render in a dialogue box, with some closeup art of the person speaking. This has the advantage that it provides a close up of characters and from a coding perspective, simplifies the code a bit because you don't have to worry about optimal positioning of the text, and you just have to work out the size of the box and where to line wrap.
However my personal preference is the classic SCUMM style in MI1 and onwards, as it doesn't obscure the art as much (on a statistical basis).
It would be nice to read about how you go about arranging speech text on the screen in TWP, in terms of working out it's positioning, dimensions of the box you would render each case in, line wraps, does localisation cause problems for the dynamic nature oofthe dimensions, etc... Is there a conscious effort to stop the speech text from covering up objects on the screen or do you just rely on the law of averages or not even care at all.
I hope others would find this topic insightful too
I feel as though I'm saying goodbye to cousins after hanging out for a couple weeks during the summer. The notion of playing this game is so exciting! There's something about the way we've been involved from the beginning that makes it extra special. Sadness mixed with anticipation.
Thanks for a great show of consistency and commitment! Your work is inspirational. The only thing I would love to hear talked about is an in depth look at the potential market you believe is out there, if you're able to assess from the reception you've experienced from those who weren't fans of your work before.
Can't wait to play this game. It's seriously the number one thing I've been looking forward to for the past few months. Call me sensational. Call me addicted. I CAN'T WAIT FOR THIS.
"... but our time together is coming to a close."
As the other blog readers said: That makes me sad too. I would recommend to do (less frequent) blog posts. Because here you have a community that could be useful for your next games (even if you won't do another kickstarter).
Thanks for the blog, the podcasts and your answers, Ron! I can't remeber that any other Kickstarter project has done this before.
P.S.: My "bet" about the coin interface vs. verb interface is still valid... ;-)
For a last dev post I suggest this:
A screencast showing a typical dev session of you fixing a bug or improving something. I would be really interesting to see you at work. You could blurr out parts of the code you are not comfortable showing. I think this would be a valuable insight!
Thanks for the ride this far! Really looking forward to the launch!
I'm not sure about this type of screencast. Fixing a bug is normally boring to watch and involves just following activities (in differing order and occurrence):
- Staring at the screen for seconds to minutes.
- Hacking away so viewers will get dizzy watching.
- Cussing
- Bashing the keyboard or whatever else is in reach
- Marking the bug as wontfix
Nowadays, it seems that we are doing this gesture for everything. It's like "42", the answer to the Ultimate Question.
I was referring to your support to NatalIja... it reminded me of this:
https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/munch_event#comment
Look for our dialogue, about at 3/4 of the scrolling bar.
;-)
Anyway, 42 2 U 2, my friend!
It has a specific meaning, which is "what do you mean/need/want/ask for"?
Anyway it is not a bad gesture, nonetheless it is not considered elegant to use it.
How about a summary of the process, the tools used, the one discarded, what was out because doesn't work, etc...
Thanks!!
Overall, it's been really fun to follow this blog and to see the game evolve. While I understand perfectly that you may not want to have this level of transparency with your next project(s), this blog has been truly exemplary in many ways.
I was wondering if there will be an "Art of TWP" additional content that ppl who missed out on backing can buy, I would be keen to see more of the backgrounds that Mark did using dithering before that idea was abandoned
Having Mark Ferrari join the team may have been Ron's wish, but was not really part of the plan, so when he joined, the art was influenced by his style.
-dZ.
For example, they showed an early version of the Quickie Pal in the Kickstarter teaser which already looked more enhanced than the wireframe art from some early screenshots or videos on this blog. I assume that Gary and Octavi would have created less animations in order to enhance all room screens, if Mark Ferrari hadn't joined the team.
Anyway, I'm so happy about Mark Ferrari's involvement for different reasons!
Then again this is not a question for features, but for blog entries. So I guess I just failed to answer it correctly and will disappear into the corner with my dunce cap...
Will the grumpy gamer blog still talk about things unrelated to Timbleweed Park?
Will everybody join one last time for a podcast about Timbleweed Park in several months?
Where do you go from here?
And will you guys continue to be the Terrible Toybox?
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1023586/8-Bit-8-Bitish-Graphics
Starting at 15:30, he describes his work on TWP.
Speaking of the podcast, are we ever going to get the 'lost' recording (#46?)
You guys should have a podcast, but not a stand up meeting, and not a Friday questions.
Instead you should have a lengthy discussion, on the project and how it developed, what goals you guys aimed for, which you reached and which failed miserably, what changed over the course of the project, your happiest and saddest memories, what you would change if anything and finally whether or not you guys achieved what you set out to do in the first place. All while shooting the breeze and having a fairly impromptu chat about the future of terribletoy box and the dozens of games you will make for us in the future!
Cheers
Jack Attack
Then, what's ahead...Tentative release dates for backer goods. Promotional plans/ideas. What needs to happen to be able to port the game to other platforms. Etc, etc.
Thanks, Ron!
I'd like to hear about the writing process. Coming up with the story, the relations between characters, the whole world of the game, coming up with relevant puzzles. How to be a writer of adventure games.
Also, how to write bad jokes and slightly better jokes.
+49
As a Kickstarter Backer and blogreader since day 1 I enjoyed this journey so much, because you did a really great job with this blog. I was amazed how much you told us about the project and have always been really happy, when a new reminder about a post was in my inbox.
So again, thank you very much! I hope the game and the sales reach all your goals.
I've done this but haven't received any responses yet.
If it's been awhile, send another one, just in case it got buried.
I'm glad to read that this blog will be continued! I'm going to stay tuned. Though I will probably avoid reading other people's comments until I have finished the game, in order to avoid spoilers.
Anyway, thank you for this dev blog! It has been very informative and has broadened my horizon! And, thank you for this game, of course!
I hope that you will do similar blogs for your future games as well, even if the frequency of blog updates would be lower.
By Retrospective I mean the typical "Sprint retrospective" with indications of what went right, what went wrong, what made you happy,sad,mad,puzzled, etc. together with some cool answers such as "each of you define the whole project with a movie title, and why", or things like that.
All the best !
Can't wait to play the game!
It has been a pleasure reading this blog, hearing the podcasts and follow the team around the Internet (and the world), we will sorely miss you.
For a final blog post, these are some ideas (some might have already been said in the previous comments):
- A retrospective on the X years of development with the entire (or as much as possible of) the team (a podcast).
- An Octavi-like video of how a room comes to life: from ideas, designs, to wireframe, code, art etc... (like he does his timelapse for his blog).
- Just write something for us, whatever!
Thank you Thimbleweed Team.
Until your next adventure!
(Yeah, I said it. I'm taking off from work for a long week-end to play the game, and I will need all the help I can get!) :)
-dZ.
If there is a walk through, do it I infocom style so if my lemon scented 5marker dried up I have to try to get the hint by mixing household chemicals. That way there is still some puzzle solving.
Btw. there is already a walkthrough for reviewers: https://twitter.com/DavidBFox/status/841706659873411072
The question is: Is a reviewer really able to judge the joy of playing a certain game when she/he used a walkthrough for finishing it, instead of puzzling about it a bit longer?
When people remember a game like Monkey Island taking 50 or 60 hours, most of the time, they were kids when that happened.
But I do can imagine that when you HAVE TO play a game and also HAVE TO play other games to write reviews about them you are more likely to be impatient. So I guess that's why you guys wrote it to begin with. It's better to have one ready if there is a need and it will be more favourable for the end result of the game's reviews if reviewer didn't get stuck early etc.
Zak McKracken took me three months to be completed, I was 14 and with poor knowledge of English.
Monkey Island took me a month, because I didn't believe it possible (aka: logic) that "Use magnetic compass" alone could actually work (I expected "with" word when using "Use" verb).
Monkey Island 2 took me 3 weeks, and I was 17/18...
Yeah, when you are a child, you are mostly distracted by everything: colours, animations, funny episodes, cutscenes... as an adult, you concentrate on puzzle solving, most of the time, and reading all the dialogues.
I'm playing Zak McKracken now. Haven't got out of the bedroom yet (just kidding... I'm already in living room. I heard there is a kitchen somewhere. Very excited to get there someday).
Is Chuck The Plant in twp?
The signals are strong with me tonite.
And maybeeeeeeee you can tell us the secret of monkey island.
https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/books_reviewed/586a784a7dce7c8b40c9cdf0
Unexpectedly, I also found the post on budget quite memorable. But I guess doing an update of that today would be pretty short "all the money has been spent/not much tasks left to budget (before main release)"
By coincidence, I'll have a week off after TP is released (though I am not planning on rushing and finishing it in a week - I want to savor and enjoy every bit of exploring it)
And I also wanted to know if there has been any different point of view between Ron and Gary during the development of the game.
Thanks very much.
Thanks for a great blog time!
Thank you Ron and Terrible Toybox! Cheers
Then I read an article about TWP being made by the same guys who made MI and MI2, and - just like those - with VERBS!!! A shame I stumbled on that article when the KS funding was over.
So, dear Terrible Toybox, please do not forsake us when TWP is a huge success :)
-dZ.
„Here is the Link to our new Kickstarter - Monkey Island 3“
Whats ok is:
-) Why I’d never do a Kickstarter again (Or Kickstarter vs traditional Process)
-) Why we’ve sold Thimbleweed to Disney (Or what we are going to do next)
-) Why the next one will be a 3D Action „Adventure“ (Or Why it took ages to make a new adventure game)
And what's next after TWP if the game will be successul.
Ron, Gary, David thank you. And Jenn, Mark and all the other talented humans that have worked and contributed to this project.
That must also include the contributors on this blog, far moreso than on most projects. Amazing support.
Whatever comes from the launch of this game, I have never seen a forum as tight and radical and supported as this dev blog. Much love to everyone involved.
In a weird, fucked up world, this brings me peace. Roll on March 30th.
Dean.
well I would expect you to once the game has aired, how much millions you have already earned and if the baking account is already full (let me know when you need a spill over account). Questions would be also, what are the feedback channels for you (is there any telemetry collected (at least for the XBOX I guess) or can people send you a smile or frawn somewhere? were the selling numbers those expected by you or where they exceeded by 100x times? After sales sounds interesting to me as I expect a huge interest in the game (if not priced at a tremendous high Niveau)
Thanks, Jens.
My dev question would be:
Since of course a lot of talk is about SCUMM and the new engine I would be interested to learn what the biggest differences are ? Were there things in SCUMM you are actually still missing in the new engine and what kind of things would you have wanted to have back then in SCUMM? Plus ... does "the engine" (plus it's tools) also have a funny name? SCUMM was so heavily used inside the games themselves so it does need a name like that , I think :-) Since you said you always hate a game you did when it comes to a close ... how about the name RAGE(tm) (Ron's Adventure Game Engine) ? ;-)
I like that - pretty funny and it matches the kind of jokes of TWP! :-)
;-)
1. the story writing process (could wait for after the release because of spoilers)
2. a retrospective: highs and lows. How did your initial plans evolve over time? What was the most unexpected thing you had to deal with?
(maybe also after release)
3. sales, budget, numbers. What did it cost in the end? How many games do you have to sell to break even/feel good/get rich enough to buy Disney. (also after the first millions are in)
But I'd also enjoy
4.. Engine stuff.
5. Music.
i.e. write reviews, share news on the game or whatever would help the success of the game.
After all most of us here are 'shareholders' without any return ;-) So the (financial) success of the game should still be in the interest of everyone.
Consider this blog and us here your homies/groupies/crowd and make USE of it ;-)
I.e. if you could need REAL feedback such as: "played this game for 10 days straight in the evening with my wife only interrupted by frequent making out.' to quote somewhere, ask for it in the last blog maybe.
MI2 had the iMuse system, wasn´t that usable for TWP as of copyright issues?
-Jens
+2, actually. That was a good idea, the iMuse system.
".. I want it all, I want it all, I want it all, and I want it now! .." !!one!exclamation-mark!1!eleven!!!!!!!!!!!!
I still have an older email for the pledge manager. I can click on it, but the only option it gives me is to make a new pledge. It asks me to confirm upping my pledge to a higher level, but doesn't mention what I've actually got. I'm sure I remember how much I gave to support, but in this page, I can't even look it up.
Will I go to this page to get a gog or steam key? How is this going to be done?
It would perfectly match the early years of pc usage...
Does somebody still use screen-saver?
I am no game designer and never will be, but in my mind puzzles and story should go hand in hand, puzzles are there to help build the story, not something put there just because it's an adventure game so they are supposed to be there.
Does this make any sense? Well, it does to me, and I guess that's what counts :D
But GF was way too Tim Burton for me. I just can't enjoy all this awkwardness about it. Somehow.
As for TP, well I only hope that we get to see the engine source. I already have a conceptualization from all the code porn Ron has released and I'm so hungry to go through the entire machine with a fine tooth comb and pick up some tricks from one of my heroes of game development.
I need TP! :D
I suppose I am very picky for graphics. It must be low resolution, so the brain creates details there aren't there. This does not happen in high res, and they look fake. For example, the special editions of Monkey 2 and Indy 4 look much more fake and still to me than the originals.
It would be awesome to have a kind of "paths tree" enlightened with the paths the current users have played.
And ring a bell each time a user finishes the game. :)
Then you could see a heat map of the paths and take the improvements for the next game?
Mr. Nor Treblig will write the precise post for you in a blink of an eye.
https://www.gog.com/news/gog_galaxy_biggest_update_yet_marks_the_end_of_beta
- Still 8 days to release? It can't be. There must be something wrong!!
- Why me. Its not fair! Testers all around the world are already enjoying it. Who's responsible for this sculduggery?
- Dear ThimbleGod, i will sacrifice my point&click finger if i receive the game early, pretty please, with bribe dough on top!
- beep I already waited years for this beepin' **beep** of beep to ship. Whooo cares. I'll play sierra games instead till the end of times. sob
- Hmpf. I have to accept it. Its only 7.9 days. Not that much after all. I just signed up for an GOG account. I'm prepared, its going to be awesome :)
Play (or re-play) this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bizarre_Adventures_of_Woodruff_and_the_Schnibble
By the way, this article provides an interesting view on GK 3: http://www.oldmanmurray.com/features/77.html
Thats not really a Sierra game.
I want all the dead ends and sudden deaths (self-flagellation) :P
Then you have to play "Stair Quest":
http://gamejolt.com/games/stair-quest/147399
That would be quite interes´ting!
It looks like "The ring", today!!!!
- To get the download address, solve the following puzzles:
1) He always takes things, seriously. Who?
2) It borns big and dies little. What is?
3) What kind of palm lives everywhere in the world?
...the key will be given first to good adventure gamers ;-)
And easier for you (Ron) to maintain..
Maybe the last post (not one_last_entry) could be left open for comments.
Then put it in the game as an Easter Egg, by typing in Thimbleweedpark.com from Delores PC.
LOAD"TWP",8,1
How much will the game cost?
I like to see......WHAT is THIS behind youm a 3 headed Monkey!!!
(16:00 .. 18:00 UTC)
https://twitter.com/grumpygamer/status/844943535702925312
Thimbleweed Park will be released at blue'o clock, according to phrenopolis: http://www.phrenopolis.com/colorclock/
That is: 9 AM UTC-7 (equivalent to 18:00 CEST, considering the Daylight Saving Time offset changing on this Sunday)
Btw. have you seen his new Twitter profile picture? He seems so.... young...
He must have used an older picture. (1987-ish is my guess).
Everyone has a male and a female side, without exception.
Mine is Franziska von Karma (http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/aceattorney/images/6/60/Franziska_von_Karma_Trilogy_Art.png/revision/20140606000015)
(or maybe not non-public only)
It's 25th in here, so 5 DAYS to Thimbleweed Park!
I wonder if these are keys for Steam or for GOG.
Btw. here are some stats about the reviewers: https://steamdb.info/app/569860/graphs/
Quick question, if you're still looking at comments (wish I asked this earlier):
Just finished your Talks at Google video (loved it!), and was wondering: You mentioned the mansion in Maniac Mansion as being sort of the main character in that game. Would you say you and the team thought of and designed the town of Thimbleweed Park as the sort of main character in this game? Or if not, do you think of it as such now looking back on the game post-development?
Would love to know your thoughts.
Randy
See this comment thread where we have tried to figure it out: https://blog.thimbleweedpark.com/text_lock#5816848b7dce7cbc10f4dbaa
Actually, we could have sensed the release date in advance! :-D
I remember a comment made by a user (more than a year ago) expressing his concern about how they graphics look, and looking at the reference he was talking about, I agreed. But I don´t know where, you made a twist and could achieve this incredible art with such cozy color palette that creates a very comfortable atmosphere.
I can´t wait to put my hands on TWP.
I can't wait for my big box!
One of my favorite quotes ever is one you said in a Maniac Mantion post-morten that I saw on GDC Vault: "sometimes it really is important to just be too stupid to know that it can't be done". I've been reading Thimbleweed Park devblog from day 0, and it seemed that this time you already had all the experience and all the tools to build this game beforehand. You even knew what the problems were going to be.
So, what do you think that was the key to keep the process of making it still fun for you, and to finally get something fresh, without that amazing driving force that is the really unknown and having to compensate unexpected problems and technical limitations with pure magic and creativity?
I know about some new problems that have arisen and you commented on this blog and/or on some interviews, but a last post would be a good place to sum up all that experience, highlight what was really unexpected (for good or for bad), and to finally compact all it in another killing line to be quoted in the future.
Oh man how funny the Achievements are. https://www.trueachievements.com/game/Thimbleweed-Park/achievements
I haven't taken any closer look at this list :-)
But: What happened to the sadist in you! (I've also searched for the book achievement)